Tired of going up the #406 East Fork Herman Creek Trail? Then take the #407 Herman Creek Trail on the west side of Woolly Horn Ridge.



I'm sorry, the Starvation Ridge trail doesn't exist yet, try the #414 Viento Ridge trail or the #415 Viento Creek trail as seen here:



Say,  what is between the #411 Wyeth Trail and the #413 Defiance trail? Of course, the #412 Lindsey Ridge trail:



I had a really extraordinary day at the UO library MAP collection. I would have mentioned that I was going there to this forum but the trip was iffy from the get go and some last minute job stuff almost scuppered the whole deal. Anyway I made it, took more than 1000 photos of 20+ maps - 7.5', 15', 30', and Mt Hood FS maps. The UO staff was very helpful with my numerous requests, very knowledgeable, and made my visit quite productive. While they have a scanner and I was given permission to use it, I stuck with the camera - a scanner, while providing better quality images, would have taken much longer to do the number of maps I requested. Were I to make another visit I'd likely take my own scanner, something as big as I can afford with a removable lid as the size of some of the maps is huge. Knowing more about the collection will cut down the number of maps to do in a visit.

All the maps are in mylar so there are reflections of lights, camera, and the photographer. So while the production values are weak the content is dramatic. There are nearly 4GB of raw JPEG images and I can make these available but downloading over cable modem or DSL will take a while. I can make DVDs.

Here's the list of maps I imaged today:

MOUNT HOOD NATIONAL FOREST

    1938 1:126,720 98x95cm Flat/no text on verso, color, contours. (Tom, is this the one you have?)
    1946 1:126,720 98x88cm Flat/no text on verso, color, eds. with contours and without contours.
    1963 1:126,720 57x89cm Folded/text & ill. on verso, color, 2 sheets: North half -- South half.
    1963 1:126,720 57x89cm Flat/no text on verso, color, 2 sheets:

15' maps

Battle Ax (4) "1956" [Printed] 1958. 1 copy, w/green screen
"1956" [Printed] 1963. 2 copies
"1956" [Printed] 1973. 1 copy, w/green screen
"1956" [Printed] 1980. 1 copy, w/green screen

Bonneville Dam, "1957" [Printed] 1959. 2 copies
Oreg.-Wash. (3) "1957" [Printed] 1968. 1 copy, w/green screen
"1957" [Printed 1976] w/1968 1 copy, w/green screen

Breitenbush Hot Springs "1961" [Printed] 1964. 2 copies
(3) "1961" [Printed] 1969. 1 copy, w/green screen
"1961" [Printed] 1980. 1 copy, w/green screen

Fish Creek Mtn. (3) "1956" [Printed] 1958. 1 copy, w/green screen
"1956" [Printed] 1963. 1 copy, w/green screen
"1956" [Printed 1975?]wo/date 2 copies

High Rock (3) "1956" [Printed] 1958. 1 copy, w/green screen
"1956" [Printed] 1963. 1 copy, w/green screen
"1956" [Printed] 1974. 1 copy, w/green screen

Hood River, Oreg.-Wash. "1957" [Printed] 1959. 2 copies
(3) "1957" [Printed] 1963. 2 copies
"1957" [Printed] 1971. 1 copy, w/green screen
--------------------------
1deg 30'

Estacada (4)
Edition of 1916. Reprinted 1938.
1 copy, w/o green screen
Edition of 1916. Reprinted 1948.
1 copy, w/o green screen

Hood River, Wash. - Oreg. (4)     Edition of 1929.     1 copy, w/o green screen
      Edition of 1929. Reprinted 1940.     1 copy, w/o green screen
      Edition of 1929. Reprinted 1950.     1 copy, w/o green screen
      "1926" [Printed] 1955.     2 copies

Mount Hood (4)     Edition of 1927.     1 copy, w/o green screen
      Edition of 1927. Reprinted 1931.     1 copy, w/o green screen
      Edition of 1927. Reprinted 1944.     1 copy, w/o green screen
      "1924" [Printed] 1955.     2 copies

----------------------------

7.5'

Mount Hood North      1962       2 copies             1964
Mount Hood South     1962     2 copies           1964
Mount Defiance Oreg.-Wash      1979       Green screen             1980
Dee      1979       2 copies             1980
Wahtum Lake      1979      Green screen             1980
Carson, Wash.-Oreg.      1979       Green screen             1980
Tanner Butte, Oreg.-Wash      1979      Green screen             1980
Rhododendron      1962       2 copies             1964
Wanderers Peak      1985 P      2 copies             1986
Hickman Butte      1962       2 copies             1963

There may be a couple of other 7.5 maps.
-----------------------

The list of maps originates from links at:

http://libweb.uoregon.edu/map/map_resources/topo_lists.html

See the entries for historical topo maps. For some reason, starting with the UO library page I've had difficulty navigating to this page so bookmark if you are interested in a return visit. Also, looks like these maps do not show up in the UO library search engine.

I've a lot of cataloging and organizing to do. I made 2 passes through each map and zoomed in on bits and pieces. I think I'll do one directory per map and make a bunch of easy to digest zip-files for each map. Portland Hikers should have a digital map library - maybe this could kickstart something like that. My plan is to put all images from this venture in the Public Domain to remove any restrictions on use.

--Paul

PS Try this bon mot--->>

Pablo,

I've done the Tanner Butte to eagle Creek via Opal Creek some time ago. Take care of the side of eagle Creek that you end up on....

West Fork of Herman has always been a thought of mine. Done some of the upper and some of the lower portions. The trail quickly vanishes and is quite difficult to follow. The understory is brutal. This is one of the reasions I pioneered The Wooley Horn Ridge 35 years ago.

I'm thinking that I would get back to the West fork this coming summer on a 2 day trip. Who knows what lives there. I imagine that it get very little human exposure.

Regards, Carlos

PS Perhaps I'll see you there.

Another trail lost to the Bull Run WS. I think this one could be recovered, just take off to the east a little earlier. This one is on my list for summer.

carlos masters:

Pablo,

I've done the Tanner Butte to eagle Creek via Opal Creek some time ago. Take care of the side of eagle Creek that you end up on....

West Fork of Herman has always been a thought of mine. Done some of the upper and some of the lower portions. The trail quickly vanishes and is quite difficult to follow. The understory is brutal. This is one of the reasions I pioneered The Wooley Horn Ridge 35 years ago.

I'm thinking that I would get back to the West fork this coming summer on a 2 day trip. Who knows what lives there. I imagine that it get very little human exposure.

Regards, Carlos

PS Perhaps I'll see you there.

It must be really bad as Woolly Horn Ridge is no picnic. I would like to explore that bowl below Tomlike and it would be neat to see if the old blazes are visible along West Herman Creek.

--Paul

Matt, Zach, Casey and Tom, you guys paying attention to that snippet of the old ROAD that climbs up the Lindsey Creek drainage, right past the two falls?  Begins to explain a lot.

---

Bryan Swan
http://www.waterfallsnorthwest.com

Sore Feet:

Matt, Zach, Casey and Tom, you guys paying attention to that snippet of the old ROAD that climbs up the Lindsey Creek drainage, right past the two falls?  Begins to explain a lot.

Here's some detail.

Thanks, Paul - I love the idea of a creating some sort of historic map archive! One very good way to do that would be through the Field Guide, since you can thumbnail the maps from much larger, downloadable images. The main question is really file size. As you know, I've got a few of these, and would love to post snippets for broader use. Since everything you've listed (and everything I've got) originated in public domain, there's no issue about republishing the material on the web. If you're interested in looking at something like this, let me know, and I'll follow up with Steve to see if we can set up a demo to test it out.

Bryan, take a look at Google Earth, rotated to view the mouth of Lindsay Creek at about a 45 degree perspective. I can see the vegetation mark of an old road departing the creek near the powerline crossing, and traversing up the canyon wall. But then I lose it, and it doesn't make much sense that it would drop back down and cross the creek, twice, per the map. Puzzling.

More interesting are the shadows along Lindsay Creek - you can see the mapped drop that Casey photographed last week... but there are a couple more just upstream, and before the first major fork, that look promising!

Tom

I scrambled up to that old road last week on the way to Lindsey Falls. I'd say it was about 150 feet above the creek on the cliffy east side. Who knows, maybe there was once a trail down to the falls from there, as from the road it's pretty obvious that there's a large drop in the canyon. However, there was no trace of the road near the powerline crossing (or even a trail to maintain the powerlines for that matter. I bet quite a few of these obscure gorge waterfalls were more well known back at the time of these maps. However, I can't really see that being the case with Moffett Creek's waterfalls. I can't picture a road in Wahe Canyon.


Casey Currey-Wilson

I think that's true, Casey - to the extent that the old rangers used to actually live in the forest, and walked countless trails that are now lost or displaced by roads. In the case of the State Park land in the Gorge (including bits of Summit and Lindsay Creek), it's fair to say that they were more likely to be explored, simply because most started out as Donation Land Claims, and were later donated to the State of Oregon. So it goes to reason that they would have been fairly well explored as private land claims.

That road has me wondering if it's a segment of the old wagon road that crosses Shellrock Mountain. You can see it quite clearly west of Summit Creek, but I've never explored the "Old Wagon Road Historical Area" that shows up on the topo maps. I'm thinking that there must be some notable road traces in there to warrant a special protection.

Tom

Pablo, what in incredible thread you've begun here!  Pretty exciting stuff.  I find the old Herman Creek trail fascinating!  I've been looking at the map and longing to explore that area.  Think of all the undisturbed wildlife up in such a major drainage!  And to think that there was a trail along the stream at one point.  Pretty cool.  Do you suppose there are any waterfalls up Herman itself?  All of these snip-its are entrancing.

-Zach 

chameleon:

Pablo, what in incredible thread you've begun here!  Pretty exciting stuff.  I find the old Herman Creek trail fascinating!  I've been looking at the map and longing to explore that area.  Think of all the undisturbed wildlife up in such a major drainage!  And to think that there was a trail along the stream at one point.  Pretty cool.  Do you suppose there are any waterfalls up Herman itself?  All of these snip-its are entrancing.

-Zach 

Zach,

I'd suspect any waterfalls would be marked as it certainly has had human visitors, but someone's going to have to take a look.

I'm having a lot of fun looking at these old maps - I hope to get them online soon.

--Paul

Here's one that gets me going from the 1963 MHNF south map - a number of trails on the Roaring River.  Things that stand out are the location of the #507 Corral Springs trail so it is aligned with the #511 trail up the South Fork - the #507 has since been relocated, I believe so it no longer meets the South Fork. The #506 Plaza Creek trail joining with the (gasp) #509 Roaring River trail. The frosting on this cake is the #509 meeting up with the Hambone trail. I need a time machine.

There used to be a website by either OSU or U of O, can't remember which, where you could download USGS quads. However, I can't find it anymore. Does anyone remember this site?

If I remember correctly, there was an overview map of the state, and you could click on a county. Then it had an overview map of the county showing all the quads. You could then click on the quads to download them.

I think it only had maps for the western part of the state, but it was a great resource. I had downloaded most of the available maps. Unfortunately, my computer crashed about 5 years ago and I had no back-up at the time, so I lost them all and haven't been able to find the website since.

I've still got the old hard-drive the maps are on if anyone knows how to retrieve info from a dead drive. 8^)

---

"Come visit us again and again. This is a state of excitement. But for heaven's sake, don't move here to live." Tom McCall

Pablo,

Nice job putting this together and thank you! Looks like the off-trail group is going to have a very interesting season once the snow melts. I think I'll head up and check out the Lindsey Creek area at the first available opportunity since the snow should be gone from that area pretty soon.  I've tracked some of the old wagon road and wondered about some of the traces of grade I noticed.

Don

---

"If I had known I was going to live this long I'd have taken better care of myself" - anon

Cattrapper:

There used to be a website by either OSU or U of O, can't remember which, where you could download USGS quads. However, I can't find it anymore. Does anyone remember this site?

If I remember correctly, there was an overview map of the state, and you could click on a county. Then it had an overview map of the county showing all the quads. You could then click on the quads to download them.

I think it only had maps for the western part of the state, but it was a great resource. I had downloaded most of the available maps. Unfortunately, my computer crashed about 5 years ago and I had no back-up at the time, so I lost them all and haven't been able to find the website since.

I've still got the old hard-drive the maps are on if anyone knows how to retrieve info from a dead drive. 8^)

From what I read on the UO Map site the DRGs for the NW part of Oregon  are available at:

http://libweb.uoregon.edu/map/map_section/map_librarydata.html

If you want other, they're out there, keep looking. You can purchase National Geographic TOPO! for oregon and you get all of them in a nice format for not a lot of money - $80-90 or something.

In the Field Guide there is the Google Maps app that has links to the USGS WMS service - this service has the current crop of digital topos. The problem is the rasterization of the topo maps was done fairly recently so very few historical USGS maps have been digitized.

--Paul